Mental health, gut health and dental health

[snowbunny]

I had a general musing this morning as I was brushing the dogs' teeth.

We know that mental health and gut health are related. That's why during times of stress we can get a little out of sorts "down there". It's something I've looked into a little during my anxiety studies and one of the reasons I switched from a kibble diet to a fresh food diet, as it appears it's a two-way street; not only can anxiety lead to an upset gut, an upset gut can lead to anxiety.

You all know the situation here: Willow and Shadow, four year old litter mates, identical upbringing (bar the time between 8 and 14 weeks of age), identical diets. Both with some level of anxiety, but Willow's is far more generalised.

As I was brushing their teeth, I made a connection. I don't know if it's a true connection or not, but it makes sense to me. Shadow's teeth are almost perfect, just the tiniest amount of discolouration on the top of the canines. Willow's are much worse (I'll try to get a photo later). What are the chances that this is linked to her gut health and anxiety levels? Pretty bloody good, I'd say, considering the other factors. Does this mean that poor teeth can be indicative of poor mental health? Maybe.
My measure of how her gut health is has always been how well-formed her poos are (sorry if TMI, but, y'know, we're dog owners, obsessed with poo), but they're consistently good, other than the odd blip. Maybe keeping an eye on her teeth will help, too.

Anyway, there's no real point to this, I just wanted to get my thoughts down "on paper", so to speak.

 

[Emily]

Hmm, interesting.

I was actually talking to the vet about teeth recently as Ella's are quite bad so I think we'll book her in to get them cleaned in the next couple of months. Our conversation was about raw feeding/bones to help keep teeth clean. The vets opinion was that dogs are like humans and some have teeth that are more susceptible to plaque build up and decay than others. Of course good dental care helps though. I assume this was just his opinion though and I didn't ask for the scientific data to support it ?

 

[HAH]

Does this mean that poor teeth can be indicative of poor mental health?

Ooh, there's gold here: as soon as I read your post I thought "fascinating, there must be plenty of evidence for this in hooman studies" but on a quick search, it looks like this is still am emerging field. There have been a couple of recent papers No Mental Health without Oral Health and reviews Poor oral health and severe mental illness: what are the links? in this area, but less than I thought there'd be.
Even more interestingly, this link between dental health, mental health and gut health (or the gut microbiome) is another emerging area of investigation in what's sometimes called the gut-brain axis; for example this paper talks about the possible application of probiotics to help treat anxiety and depression: Gut microbiota’s effect on mental health: The gut-brain axis
It's early days and does mean there's a lot of less robust work out there, but it's a strong theory that there is some interaction between teeth, gut and brain that we're understanding more as time goes on.

 

[snowbunny]

Yes, the stuff I've read to date on the gut-brain axis is fascinating! To bring teeth into the equation too is another facet and potential diagnostic tool, especially with non-verbal animals and humans.

I've not read the links you've included yet (although it's entirely possible I've read them previously!) but I'll have a look later on.

 

[snowbunny]

The vets opinion was that dogs are like humans and some have teeth that are more susceptible to plaque build up and decay than others.

I think this is today's perceived knowledge. But to me, it seems like it could lead to treating the symptom rather than the cause in some situations. Why should some teeth (in whatever species) be more susceptible to plaque? Is that a physical feature of the teeth themselves, or is it of the saliva (or A. N. Other)? And if it's the saliva, what is causing that to have the properties that are causing the problems?
If it were the case (and this is a big if that, even if true surely won't be true in all cases) that an unexpected build-up of plaque, or bad breath, or whatever other oral issue we could see were actually attributed to the gut, then sorting out the gut flora could fix that problem, rather than just using a band-aid (scaling, brushing, raw bones, professional cleaning) to get the teeth back to health. I'm not saying having a healthy gut would negate the need to brush your dog's teeth, just that an unprecedented build-up or unexpectedly rapid decay could be slowed by creating a healthy gut biome.
Adding the mental health implications in there is just the extra facet that I'm always going to find interesting, as it's my main area of study in dog behaviour.

 

[Oberon]

Saliva production has a big effect on plaque and tooth decay. Saliva quality has a genetic component. The quality of tooth enamel also has a genetic component and is definitely also a factor in oral health.

 

[snowbunny]

Saliva quality has a genetic component. The quality of tooth enamel also has a genetic component and is definitely also a factor in oral health.

That's interesting. So, expanding on this, I wonder how much this can be influenced by the epigenome. As we know now, the nature vs nurture idea is old-hat, as nature cannot be expressed without an environment in which to do so, which can then influence the expression of the genome itself. The genetic component of the saliva is a very obvious example of this; whatever the composition of the saliva is genetically determined to be, that cannot be viewed in isolation because a dog gotta eat! Even before we get into other environmental factors that can have an impact.

It's obviously a complicated topic - anything to do with genetics is - but I do love that this is cutting-edge stuff that might actually make a big difference to individuals, if we keep on pushing for answers to these deeper questions rather than simply relying on fixing the resultant problem we can see.

For my interests, I would be very interested in reading about any links between oral health and mental health, so I'll be digging around in addition to reading the links above from @HAH

 

[Oberon]

I think the problem is going to be establishing a causal relationship. Yes, there is a link between oral health and mental health but a whole lot of that is going to be because people with poor mental health aren’t taking care of their teeth (or can’t afford dental care).

 

[Oberon]

Also, in the other causal direction, people with mouths and teeth that are in bad condition are no doubt at risk of poor mental health outcomes as a result of pain, shame etc. And if they also have poor gut health that’s probably in part to do with poor diet (both cause and consequence of a painful mouth) and the well-known toxic effects on the gut/organs of decay, oral bacteria etc.

 

[HAH]

I think the problem is going to be establishing a causal relationship

Completely agree, this is always the problem and not sure how you'd demonstrate causality as RCTs aren't suited/ethical for this level of longitudinal work. More research needed, but in what direction = not so clear.

 

[snowbunny]

Yep, as I was typing that, I had a glimmer of remembering that my sister did some research into the link between mental illness and poor oral health for one of her degrees (nursing and paramedic degrees). She's on holiday at the moment, but I've sent her a message to ask if I can read it on her return

 

[Heidrun]

Hmmm, not sure about this. The state of my dogs't teeth varies from very clean to dodgy. The one with the cleanest teeth by a mile is Murffi who can only be described as 'mental'. Caddie on the other hand is my most robust dog in absolutely every sense but her teeth are always stained and covered in plaque. Neither one is troubled with gut issues.

 

[snowbunny]

Well even if there is a link, it doesn't mean that it's the only reason for having good or bad teeth. The environment has many different elements. We also can't see the state of the gut to say there categorically are or are not issues, other than the obvious But while we can probably say that there's an issue with the gut when the poo is squiffy, it doesn't mean that just because the poo is kickable that the gut is completely healthy.

I may be way off the mark, as it was simply a case of putting two and two together and potentially getting √-1, but the new research is of interest. To me, at least

 

[Stacia]

An interesting observation @snowbunny, I have a very good book on The Gut (well I was told it was good, haven't read it yet), this one is humans but I guess dogs are similar, though they have much stronger stomach acid. My Drift was a re-active dog, difficult, but I loved him and his teeth were perfect. If one was doing a Masters it would be an interesting avenue to pursue.

 

[Charlie]

Charlie's teeth are pretty perfect for a 7 1/2 year old, beautifully white apart from some plaque on his very back molars that I find difficult to reach and clean, so my fault. He is as bonkers as they come and some, not had the best start in life, he has a bit of a sensitive tum yet his teeth are as the vet says "fabulous" she always makes a note on his records to reflect this. Hattie is as laid back as a dog can be, no gut issues at all, in fact it's cast iron. Her teeth aren't as good as Charlies, no plaque just a bit of discolouration that I am working on but she is almost 11 years old, the vet assures me they are good for her age, so to be expected. They are both kibble fed. I have seen some very young dogs with awful teeth. x