To neuter or not

[Kelsey]

Well, I am at a point where Hugo can be neutered any time now as he’s 18 months old. Ideally if I’m going to do it I would like to get it done in the next couple of months before spring and summer arrive. Neutering seems to be viewed differently depending where you live in the world. In Canada it is the norm to neuter your dogs, larger dogs they recommend to wait until 18 months old, this is newer practice as it used to be done at 6 months old. Axel I had done at 12 months old and noticed a huge improvement with marking, humping and smegma, but otherwise everything else stayed the same.

Ultimately I want to do what is best for Hugo but here are the reasons I want to neuter him

1- marking his territory inside stores/vet offices where dogs have been. It’s so fast that I don’t always catch him

2- I do not have a fenced in yard and I do worry if he were to run after a scent.

3- the penis dribbles!! My duvet turns in to a Dalmatian so fast. I also neutered Axel for this, I had dark floors that were Dalmatian spotted with his smegma but stopped as soon as he was neutered.

3- he’s got some reactivity with male dogs now which I’m not sure if that will continue to ease off as his hormones level out at his age or not. I’m working a lot with high reward treats and getting excited about the upcoming dog, seems to help some, but if the other dog reacts also then it’s just chaos. Putting him in a sit does not help, it escalates things. Axel did have this issue too between a year and two years old…then he was bomb proof, so maybe a confidence issue with some until they mature a bit more?

Reasons why I don’t want to neuter him

1- I worry about muscle loss and not maintaining his stocky appearance.

2- cancer, I want to do what I can to lower the chance of a cancer diagnosis again but I also have read intact males develop cancer too, so is this just a gamble either way?

That’s kind of all I got for this list to be honest… but that’s why I’m writing this. I would love insight from you all

 

[Kelsey]

Just to add… he’s never in the yard without me, but sometimes he goes deaf when there is a good smell, and while we have made major progress with recall, I do worry if he were to smell a bitch in season he would remain deaf

 

[M.F.]

I’d keep him intact a bit longer. He needs his hormones for physical and emotional development, and intact dogs have a lower risk of cancer of the long bones.

If you can manage him intact, then give it a bit more time.

The smegma gets better as they get older.

 

[Stacia]

I had my 2 Labs castrated, I wasn't going to have Rourke done but he was leaving prepuce catarrh all over the house. It did not alter his muscle or stature. The cancer they can get is prostate. I would leave it a little longer if you can. Many people think you should keep a dog entire but I feel that is unfortunate for the dog, his natural instincts are frustrated, but that is just me! I think it is your choice and you will be swayed either way!

 

[SwampDonkey]

I only neuter for medical reasons. I've learned to recognise Ivers behaviours around ISB smell and put him on his lead I usually leave the area too. I prefer leave them intact they have better muscle development have better angulation in their hips so less hip problems They do seem to mature into more even adults with less puppy behaviours. They seem to grow up and are not stuck in puppy behaviours I find them more reasonable in a lot a of ways.They do seem healthier uncastrated. I dont mind penis prints. I had dog who developed an auto immune disorder after castration the vet thought this too due to no nuts too. You do have to train harder for some things. I don't have issues with humping it's not allowed and never has been. I redirect and learn what things set each dog off often it's over excitement so I calm things down. I trained for this as well as calmness when greeting other dogs, but I don't let my dogs greet others often, especially on leads. Reactivity and over excitement won't improve with castration it's a confidence thing and may get worse if he has no testosterone because he'll feel less brave. I've had both and see no real differences in behaviour Rory is now castrated due to a suspicious testicle and is the same dog he ever was. I don't see the point of fixing something that's not broken. If you feel you want to castrate leave them entire as long as you can. Over 2 at least you want them as mature as possible, physically and mentally. Castrated dogs can still developed cancers just different ones like sarcoma.

 

[HAH]

Well, I am at a point where Hugo can be neutered any time now as he’s 18 months old. Ideally if I’m going to do it I would like to get it done in the next couple of months before spring and summer arrive. Neutering seems to be viewed differently depending where you live in the world. In Canada it is the norm to neuter your dogs, larger dogs they recommend to wait until 18 months old, this is newer practice as it used to be done at 6 months old. Axel I had done at 12 months old and noticed a huge improvement with marking, humping and smegma, but otherwise everything else stayed the same.

Ultimately I want to do what is best for Hugo but here are the reasons I want to neuter him

1- marking his territory inside stores/vet offices where dogs have been. It’s so fast that I don’t always catch him

2- I do not have a fenced in yard and I do worry if he were to run after a scent.

3- the penis dribbles!! My duvet turns in to a Dalmatian so fast. I also neutered Axel for this, I had dark floors that were Dalmatian spotted with his smegma but stopped as soon as he was neutered.

3- he’s got some reactivity with male dogs now which I’m not sure if that will continue to ease off as his hormones level out at his age or not. I’m working a lot with high reward treats and getting excited about the upcoming dog, seems to help some, but if the other dog reacts also then it’s just chaos. Putting him in a sit does not help, it escalates things. Axel did have this issue too between a year and two years old…then he was bomb proof, so maybe a confidence issue with some until they mature a bit more?

Reasons why I don’t want to neuter him

1- I worry about muscle loss and not maintaining his stocky appearance.

2- cancer, I want to do what I can to lower the chance of a cancer diagnosis again but I also have read intact males develop cancer too, so is this just a gamble either way?

That’s kind of all I got for this list to be honest… but that’s why I’m writing this. I would love insight from you all

I talked to our vet about this today re. Stilton, and did a lot of reading up when we were considering getting Kipper castrated so have some thoughts.

The main reason we didn’t get Kipper done was because of temperament. He’s cautious by nature, and drastically reducing his testosterone and creating a hormone imbalance would likely have served him badly and increased anxiety.

The other main reason for me was that I didn’t want to remove a key part of biological function without a solid reason, and some cancers/other heath conditions are more prevalent in castrated dogs, where testosterone is thought to have a protective effect.

With Stilton, he’s different to Kipper in confidence - he’s resilient and quite bombastic! So temperamental issues aren’t such a concern, although it’s unpredictable how his character might change if castrated. Our trainer we worked with recently suggested it might be beneficial for him to be castrated, and reduce his frustrations around Kipper - but that’s an unknown. Her history is working with rescue dogs, and so is far more used to castration as a matter of course.

Talking to our vet today, she highlighted increased ACL damage in castrated dogs, lower muscle mass generally in castrated dogs, and that there are still a lot of uncertainties about the health and other effects of significantly changing dogs’ sex hormones through castration - for that alone she’s cautious in her advice. She’s also pointed out that any cancer needing castration was generally well managed simply by removing the testicles - so if that was an issue down the line, it’s usually a straightforward solution. She has Stilton’s brother, so was saying that until they’re 18-20 months she’s not thinking of it, and after that they may try temporary castration (implants) to see what effect it has on behaviour.

There are lots of things to weigh up, and only you know your specific situation and hard lines. I’d recommend temporary castration to begin with if possible - it’s not cheap, but it gives you a good idea of effect while being reversible.

 

[edzbird]

Coco was castrated at 15 months - just before we got him. I feel he has never developed emotionally/mentally- he is an idiot in front of other dogs. He is a confident dog. He very occasionally gets humpy even now and needs redirecting. Muscle-wise & joint-wise I think he is great. He could be more muscley, but I think that's down to exercise rather than hormones. To be honest, I'm glad the decision was out of my hands, it's a toughie.

 

[Cath]

I have never had any of my boys done, but he is your dog. I am sure you will do what is best for him.

 

[Kelsey]

Thank you for personal insights, I realize it does really come down to a personal decision but it’s nice to hear other peoples views, especially those not from my side of the world.

I think my biggest deciding factor will be how male dogs interact with him over the next bit. As 95% if not more of male dogs here are neutered, it may cause more stress for him to constantly have dogs having ‘words’ with him as I call it.

 

[M.F.]

Snowie is 13 years old. He was intact up till a year ago, when we used a Suprelorin implant cos he had a severely enlarged prostate (very painful). It was extremely effective. But I noticed he got significantly weaker. It’s wearing off now (we used the 1-year implant cos it was readily available; in hindsight, I’d have preferred the 6-month implant) and he appears better for that.

He has no joint or ACL issues. Whereas his brother, neutered at 10 months, had severe pain in his joints in his final years (he passed away a few weeks ago).

However, Snowie was a challenge to manage! Very humpadelic! But also very friendly and not an aggressive bone in his body. And loved by most dogs. A very easygoing, confident dog. But in retrospect, I’d have tried the implant at around 5 years just to reduce the humping, it was a challenge, and of course other dog owners didn’t like it! With the implant last year, the humping stopped altogether! It was quite amazing to witness; I’d thought it had become a learned response rather than hormonal by this stage.

Bear in mind, any time you use the implant, you’re affecting the hormones and his development. So if it were me, I’d hold off on even the implant until he is more developed.

 

[HAH]

Thank you for personal insights, I realize it does really come down to a personal decision but it’s nice to hear other peoples views, especially those not from my side of the world.

I think my biggest deciding factor will be how male dogs interact with him over the next bit. As 95% if not more of male dogs here are neutered, it may cause more stress for him to constantly have dogs having ‘words’ with him as I call it.

The other thing to bear in mind with dog-dog interactions as you mention (we’re sensitive to this too, and sorry if you know all of this!) is that their male sex hormones surge during adolescence, which may be where reactivity from other dogs such as increased aggression is more common - alongside the fact that our teenage boys are still learning good body language and polite interactions, so can send mixed messages which are confusing/challenging for others. Once they get to 2 years onwards, their hormones stabilise so in theory that ‘extra’ testosteroney flava is less of an issue. It’s definitely worth seeking out current expertise on this, as I think understanding has developed a lot in the last 5 years. But I completely understand your motivation in that direction.

 

[kateincornwall]

I had wanted to keep Reuben entire but I ended up having him castrated when he was two and a half years old . My reason for the decision was due to him developing an interest in humping other dogs and also on two occasions, he followed the scent of bitches who were in the latter throes of heat , totally blanking me and this worried me greatly . I can honestly say that it did not change his character at all , it made him far less interested in his previous humping of other dogs so for me , it was the right thing to do . However , I do think it is a very personal decision to make as long as the decision is made armed with all the relevant information . I too would wait until a dog is two years old before embarking on castration , good luck xxx

 

[MellowYellow]

Hi Kelsey, I don't know if you remember but I had to have Merlin castrated for medical reasons in November 2023. I would never have done it, but it was necessary as his health was severely impacted. Here is the link to the thread, in case you are interested.

Now a little over a year after the neutering, I can say that Merlin is still a chilled, happy, healthy lad. He is possibly a little less bouncy, perhaps with slightly less joie de vivre than he used to have, and is definitely a little more unsure of himself with other dogs. He is much greedier than before, and puts on weight alarmingly easily, which means he now gets miniscule amounts of food and seems constantly hungry and is always begging for food. People note that his body shape has changed and that he seems chunkier. On the positive side, he never tries to hump other dogs or lick our visitors' ears any more (some people hated this; others found it charming; I didn't like it because I knew it was his version of foreplay, so when he started that he had to be sent out of the room!). His basic sweet natured character has not changed. He still loves to go for long walks and to do dummy training. With regard to his relationship to us, if anything I would say he is even more affectionate than before.

I think on balance I would say I am less categorically opposed to neutering than I was, because I can see that Merlin is just as happy as before. However, if I ever have a young male dog again I will adopt the same 'wait and see' attitude. If Hugo is happy and generally well-behaved, and if he is not frustrated and suffering from having female dogs in heat around him a lot, then I would be inclined to wait for another year - he is likely to calm down anyway once he gets to around 2 1/2 or 3 years old. But if you do decide to go ahead with it, don't feel bad, you won't be causing him any distress (other than the brief one of the operation).

Good luck!!

 

[Kelsey]

The other thing to bear in mind with dog-dog interactions as you mention (we’re sensitive to this too, and sorry if you know all of this!) is that their male sex hormones surge during adolescence, which may be where reactivity from other dogs such as increased aggression is more common - alongside the fact that our teenage boys are still learning good body language and polite interactions, so can send mixed messages which are confusing/challenging for others. Once they get to 2 years onwards, their hormones stabilise so in theory that ‘extra’ testosteroney flava is less of an issue. It’s definitely worth seeking out current expertise on this, as I think understanding has developed a lot in the last 5 years. But I completely understand your motivation in that direction.

If I remember correctly the hormones peak at 18 months then finally level off. So with you saying two years old is where things should settle makes sense. I do a lot of hiking and I want him to be accepted more easily by unknown dogs and come across as the friendly boy I know that’s hidden under that over confident hormone boost right now . Once he meets them and they have sniffs and ‘words’ are done he gives the other dog kisses and puppy bows and just wants to play, but I really can’t wait for the stiff body and ‘words’ to stop. (I always put him on leash coming up to another dog until I can assess the other dog)

 

[Kelsey]

Thank you @M.F. And @MellowYellow both Snowie and Merlin have been on my mind regarding neutering, can’t help but wonder if enlarged prostate is bound to happen as they age or if I’m over thinking it. Obviously they are both doing great now

That’s interesting the comparison of Snowie and one of his brothers in regards to their joints!

Thank you for the reassurance regarding Merlin and how he hasn’t changed at all since being neutered

 

[Kelsey]

Coco was castrated at 15 months - just before we got him. I feel he has never developed emotionally/mentally- he is an idiot in front of other dogs. He is a confident dog. He very occasionally gets humpy even now and needs redirecting. Muscle-wise & joint-wise I think he is great. He could be more muscley, but I think that's down to exercise rather than hormones. To be honest, I'm glad the decision was out of my hands, it's a toughie.

It is such a tough decision! Honestly, Hugo is also a bit of an idiot, he’s just SO full on with excitement when other dogs are around. I can’t picture him ever being chill and mature like the other dogs that walk on by

 

[Kelsey]

Thank you everyone for your feedback, much appreciated! I feel better about waiting longer and having more of a ‘wait and see’ approach!

 

[M.F.]

An enlarged prostate is highly likely as they age, as in humans. But very easily treated, if needed, with an implant.

 

[Stacia]

@Kelsey in my experience castration did not alter the "stiff body and words" only time and training. However, they were still well muscled, did not get fat and didn't think about sex all time. However they did continue with their maleness and Rourke could always tell the farmer when his bitch would be about to to come in season

 

[Loraseal]

All dogs are different and I think you are the best judge of his temperament . Some dogs are very easily aroused and others aren't. Initially we did chemical castration. It did help but we wanted to give it time so we persevered after the chemical castratkon. I did not want to have him castrated due to the muscle tone and this helps with his weak elbows. However due to his porn star tendencies in our neighbourhood, his elbows were getting worse so we had him castrated. He has actually become slightly reactive to bigger dogs after his op which can happen. It is a very personal choice and we chose for health reasons and also combined that our neighbourhood has a high amount of dogs.